Comments on: Lazy Day Linkage: 1/4/09 http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/ a Seattle Mariners blog formerly known as Bleeding Blue and Teal Fri, 30 Jul 2010 09:50:32 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: banton http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4343 banton Mon, 05 Jan 2009 22:57:15 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4343 To those of you who believe that Griffey will put butts in the seats, I would agree; until he gets hurt or can't resurrect his long-ball image. Griffey is no better a hitter overall than is Clement, and Clement is no longer an "uber-prospect". He is not our savior at first, third, or DH. His career is on the line this year-he needs to show that he can hit. He has had his chances and blown them so far, considering how many at bats he has had. Call it rebuilding, whatever....We are not that far off, but spending tons of dough to "buy" a competitive team is what got us in this mess in the first place. I would trade Ichi, YouBet, Balentin, Lopez or anyone else in order for Z to achieve his goals. Beltre is not going anywhere before the trade deadline, neither is Bedard (whom I think will have a great year). Washburn and Silva will be gone by the end of ST. We will have a good team this year. Are we going to win the West? Who cares!! I would be happy with a competitive team and I think we will have one. Take a deep breath or two and let Z do his work. To those of you who believe that Griffey will put butts in the seats, I would agree; until he gets hurt or can’t resurrect his long-ball image. Griffey is no better a hitter overall than is Clement, and Clement is no longer an “uber-prospect”. He is not our savior at first, third, or DH. His career is on the line this year-he needs to show that he can hit. He has had his chances and blown them so far, considering how many at bats he has had.

Call it rebuilding, whatever….We are not that far off, but spending tons of dough to “buy” a competitive team is what got us in this mess in the first place. I would trade Ichi, YouBet, Balentin, Lopez or anyone else in order for Z to achieve his goals. Beltre is not going anywhere before the trade deadline, neither is Bedard (whom I think will have a great year). Washburn and Silva will be gone by the end of ST.

We will have a good team this year. Are we going to win the
West? Who cares!! I would be happy with a competitive team and I think we will have one. Take a deep breath or two and let Z do his work.

]]> By: Jon Shields http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4338 Jon Shields Mon, 05 Jan 2009 21:18:32 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4338 @ Dustin - I'm not so such that Griffey will put up numbers that are <i>that</i> much greater than Clement's, if at all. A few projections: Clement: Bill James .256/.333/.456, CHONE .252/.333/.433 Griffey: Bill James .255/.351/.451, CHONE .243/.333/.418 Projections are like weather forecasts so take them however you want, but why pay for a broken down Griffey when you can develop one of your best young players without loosing much (if any) production? I know we all love Griffey, but it's smarter to make moves with the brain and not the heart. That said, with Burrell now a Ray, the Mariners are going to be cast as the clear cut favorite for Griffey. We'll see what happens. @ Walrus - Moving Clement to third would be convenient, but doesn't seem very likely. Athleticism aside, Clement's throwing arm doesn't seem very capable of making the toss across with much authority. @ ernier - It's unfortunate that one of our best players has to be so unhappy with the team. Luckily, he'll still give it his all no matter how he feels about the rest of the roster. I wish he'd see that "going young" doesn't always mean a bad team, because the way it looks now we should be much better in 2009 than we were in 2008. If the possibility of an extension wasn't already off the table, it certainly is now. @ Dustin – I’m not so such that Griffey will put up numbers that are that much greater than Clement’s, if at all. A few projections:

Clement: Bill James .256/.333/.456, CHONE .252/.333/.433
Griffey: Bill James .255/.351/.451, CHONE .243/.333/.418

Projections are like weather forecasts so take them however you want, but why pay for a broken down Griffey when you can develop one of your best young players without loosing much (if any) production? I know we all love Griffey, but it’s smarter to make moves with the brain and not the heart.

That said, with Burrell now a Ray, the Mariners are going to be cast as the clear cut favorite for Griffey. We’ll see what happens.

@ Walrus – Moving Clement to third would be convenient, but doesn’t seem very likely. Athleticism aside, Clement’s throwing arm doesn’t seem very capable of making the toss across with much authority.

@ ernier – It’s unfortunate that one of our best players has to be so unhappy with the team. Luckily, he’ll still give it his all no matter how he feels about the rest of the roster. I wish he’d see that “going young” doesn’t always mean a bad team, because the way it looks now we should be much better in 2009 than we were in 2008.

If the possibility of an extension wasn’t already off the table, it certainly is now.

]]> By: ernier http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4336 ernier Mon, 05 Jan 2009 21:00:23 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4336 Speaking of Beltre...Larry LaRue has some interesting comments from him on his blog. http://blogs.thenewstribune.com/mariners/ Speaking of Beltre…Larry LaRue has some interesting comments from him on his blog.

http://blogs.thenewstribune.com/mariners/

]]> By: Walrus http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4335 Walrus Mon, 05 Jan 2009 14:00:01 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4335 Since there appears to be some agreement between some of us bloggers that Clement does not belong behind homeplate due to the recent knee surgeries...has anyone heard anything about what the M's intend to do - other than just evaluate when Spring Training comes along? Has anyone heard if the M's will try to put Clement at 3rd base, to possible keep some of his uber-prospect status - especially considering the currrent status of Beltre? Since there appears to be some agreement between some of us bloggers that Clement does not belong behind homeplate due to the recent knee surgeries…has anyone heard anything about what the M’s intend to do – other than just evaluate when Spring Training comes along?
Has anyone heard if the M’s will try to put Clement at 3rd base, to possible keep some of his uber-prospect status – especially considering the currrent status of Beltre?

]]> By: chris d http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4334 chris d Mon, 05 Jan 2009 13:40:10 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4334 Dustin, yes I believe that Clement will produce. He has not been given a chance to prove himself. ML pitching is very difficult to adjust to and in the past, as he has started at each minor league level he has done poorly but ended up doing very well. Look at his Tacoma stint. I say give him a chance at DH. And if Dunn can come in on a one year agreement and not take AB's away from Clement than so be it. I think Mr Z intends to give these younger potential hitters a chance, as he should. Or maybe he will trade him but I don't think he will be on the bench. Dustin, yes I believe that Clement will produce. He has not been given a chance to prove himself. ML pitching is very difficult to adjust to and in the past, as he has started at each minor league level he has done poorly but ended up doing very well. Look at his Tacoma stint. I say give him a chance at DH. And if Dunn can come in on a one year agreement and not take AB’s away from Clement than so be it.

I think Mr Z intends to give these younger potential hitters a chance, as he should. Or maybe he will trade him but I don’t think he will be on the bench.

]]> By: Dustin Shires http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4333 Dustin Shires Mon, 05 Jan 2009 08:06:27 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4333 To be honest, I don't care that Clement is the "uber-prospect." Fielding the best team possible is what matters to me, and if Griffey puts up numbers superior to Clement's, no question in my mind, give Griffey the spot in the line-up... To be honest, I don’t care that Clement is the “uber-prospect.” Fielding the best team possible is what matters to me, and if Griffey puts up numbers superior to Clement’s, no question in my mind, give Griffey the spot in the line-up…

]]> By: Jon Shields http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4332 Jon Shields Mon, 05 Jan 2009 07:30:58 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4332 I suppose the difference is that Adam Dunn would be hands down better than Clement, while Griffey wouldn't necessarily be (or marginally better at best). I suppose the difference is that Adam Dunn would be hands down better than Clement, while Griffey wouldn’t necessarily be (or marginally better at best).

]]> By: Dustin Shires http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4331 Dustin Shires Mon, 05 Jan 2009 07:20:21 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4331 Chris D So you would be opposed to signing Adam Dunn, because he'd take away at-bats from Jeff Clement? Chris D

So you would be opposed to signing Adam Dunn, because he’d take away at-bats from Jeff Clement?

]]> By: pmbaseball7 http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4330 pmbaseball7 Mon, 05 Jan 2009 07:17:39 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4330 getting rid of ichiro would also free up salary and apparently everyone hates him anyway so why not deal him and sign O-Dawg to lead it. getting rid of ichiro would also free up salary and apparently everyone hates him anyway so why not deal him and sign O-Dawg to lead it.

]]> By: chris d http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4329 chris d Mon, 05 Jan 2009 06:02:36 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4329 Griffey will only take away playing time from Clement and other younguns needing to play. Clement is not going to be a catcher. He will be the DH and if he gets playing time he will adjust and hit well. The adjustment to ML is difficult for many and he can do it but he must get AB's. Griffey will only hinder this and I don't think Mr Z will allow this to happen. He knows what this team needs better than anyone and Griffey is not it. And no big salaries for big sluggers which also would take time away from younger players. Maybe he might sign a one year contract for a left fielder, but no more. Once we get rid of $40m ( Washburn, Beltre, Baptista)in 2010 salary things will move Griffey will only take away playing time from Clement and other younguns needing to play. Clement is not going to be a catcher. He will be the DH and if he gets playing time he will adjust and hit well. The adjustment to ML is difficult for many and he can do it but he must get AB’s. Griffey will only hinder this and I don’t think Mr Z will allow this to happen. He knows what this team needs better than anyone and Griffey is not it.

And no big salaries for big sluggers which also would take time away from younger players. Maybe he might sign a one year contract for a left fielder, but no more. Once we get rid of $40m ( Washburn, Beltre, Baptista)in 2010 salary things will move

]]> By: kellykoof15 http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4328 kellykoof15 Mon, 05 Jan 2009 05:38:53 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4328 The Kid, I agree with most of what you said. I would enjoy watching Griffey play one more years in a M's uniform, as a DH and LF here and there. What I dont agree with you is, you saying we are two OF's away from being a real threat. We have Ichiro and Gutierrez, all we need is one OF and hopefully that OF can bat 3rd. The Kid, I agree with most of what you said. I would enjoy watching Griffey play one more years in a M’s uniform, as a DH and LF here and there. What I dont agree with you is, you saying we are two OF’s away from being a real threat. We have Ichiro and Gutierrez, all we need is one OF and hopefully that OF can bat 3rd.

]]> By: The Kid http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4327 The Kid Mon, 05 Jan 2009 05:10:11 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4327 I do not understand why we are so set on rebuilding. Especially now with a weakened AL West, we should be doing whatever it takes in the market to get back in it now. It IS possible to rejuvenate the farm system as we reload this year instead of rebuild. If the puzzle pieces that we bring in can all work out, there is no reason we cannot turn it around as the Rays did. It is not only about the success of the team, but for the success of the franchise as a whole: make some moves, spend money in the right spots, and hope for some good luck. I do not see how somebody like Matsui isn't good enough for the Yankees, but he would fit in with us..I don't get why everyone bashes the idea of a Griffey return to finish his illustrious career: it would not only put fans in the seats, but I feel it is right by us to get him back and let him fulfill his dream of finishing back where it started like he wants. On top of that, the Rays, who were just short of a World Series Championship(something the M's haven't had in the 30 years of existence), would somehow find it a good fit to sign Griffey and put him into their lineup. Other than that, it is imperative to keep Ichiro unless we get guaranteed studs. We should be going for Bobby Abreu to replace Ibanez, and someone on top of that. If we need to shop people, then shop everyone, but I feel that would be the wrong move. We are two outfielders and a starting pitcher(possibly Bedard) away from being a real threat. Let's get it done now, not in the future. If we do it now, the future will work itself out. I do not understand why we are so set on rebuilding. Especially now with a weakened AL West, we should be doing whatever it takes in the market to get back in it now. It IS possible to rejuvenate the farm system as we reload this year instead of rebuild. If the puzzle pieces that we bring in can all work out, there is no reason we cannot turn it around as the Rays did. It is not only about the success of the team, but for the success of the franchise as a whole: make some moves, spend money in the right spots, and hope for some good luck. I do not see how somebody like Matsui isn’t good enough for the Yankees, but he would fit in with us..I don’t get why everyone bashes the idea of a Griffey return to finish his illustrious career: it would not only put fans in the seats, but I feel it is right by us to get him back and let him fulfill his dream of finishing back where it started like he wants. On top of that, the Rays, who were just short of a World Series Championship(something the M’s haven’t had in the 30 years of existence), would somehow find it a good fit to sign Griffey and put him into their lineup. Other than that, it is imperative to keep Ichiro unless we get guaranteed studs. We should be going for Bobby Abreu to replace Ibanez, and someone on top of that. If we need to shop people, then shop everyone, but I feel that would be the wrong move. We are two outfielders and a starting pitcher(possibly Bedard) away from being a real threat. Let’s get it done now, not in the future. If we do it now, the future will work itself out.

]]> By: Jon Shields http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4326 Jon Shields Mon, 05 Jan 2009 04:24:30 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4326 That was just one very pessimistic scout that compared Morrow to Clement. I think he'll be fine. That was just one very pessimistic scout that compared Morrow to Clement. I think he’ll be fine.

]]> By: Slurve http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4325 Slurve Mon, 05 Jan 2009 03:39:36 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4325 Well the Morrow article is regarding his mechanics not his stuff stuff wise he is a number 3 starter or higher(then again I heard he is just a Matt Clement all FB and nothing else) they are pretty troubling but if he stays healthy or we can get a good 1000-1500IP before his arm blows out we'll be ok Strasburg I heard also has pretty troubling mechanics as well. Well the Morrow article is regarding his mechanics not his stuff stuff wise he is a number 3 starter or higher(then again I heard he is just a Matt Clement all FB and nothing else) they are pretty troubling but if he stays healthy or we can get a good 1000-1500IP before his arm blows out we’ll be ok Strasburg I heard also has pretty troubling mechanics as well.

]]> By: Digger http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4324 Digger Mon, 05 Jan 2009 03:13:04 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4324 Reading the tea leaves: If Ichiro leaves, the leadoff man is Jerry Hairston. Reading the tea leaves: If Ichiro leaves, the leadoff man is Jerry Hairston.

]]> By: pmbaseball7 http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4323 pmbaseball7 Mon, 05 Jan 2009 03:12:08 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4323 If we can get Swisher, Montero, and Kennedy/McAllister then i think we have to do that. That quote about Washburn killed me but is true. If we can get Swisher, Montero, and Kennedy/McAllister then i think we have to do that. That quote about Washburn killed me but is true.

]]> By: Mariner Melee http://www.proballnw.com/01-2009/lazy-day-linkage-1409/comment-page-1/#comment-4322 Mariner Melee Mon, 05 Jan 2009 02:33:15 +0000 http://www.bleedingblueandteal.com/?p=1338#comment-4322 The Morrow article is very discouraging. Everyone though that Lincecum was going to be the injury risk, but if this article is correct, it will just make the Mariners and the pother 7 (I think) teams to pass on Lincecum look even more foolish. I hope for the sake of Morrow and mariners fans that this turns out to be a non issue. Wow...scary though. The Morrow article is very discouraging. Everyone though that Lincecum was going to be the injury risk, but if this article is correct, it will just make the Mariners and the pother 7 (I think) teams to pass on Lincecum look even more foolish.

I hope for the sake of Morrow and mariners fans that this turns out to be a non issue. Wow…scary though.

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