Comments on: Master of Predicting the Breakout? http://www.proballnw.com/07-2009/master-of-predicting-the-breakout/ ESPN-affiliated Seattle Mariners blog Fri, 10 Feb 2012 18:50:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Lonnie http://www.proballnw.com/07-2009/master-of-predicting-the-breakout/comment-page-1/#comment-6260 Lonnie Wed, 15 Jul 2009 03:34:31 +0000 http://www.proballnw.com/?p=1879#comment-6260 Oh, I'm not horribly upset. I just seeing a much bigger need in the very near future for SP, especially if so many folks get their wish and we lose Bedard and Washburn. Also, I guess I carry water for players who aren't annointed as the next great thing but succeed anyways. That explains my fixation on guys like Juan Diaz, Alex Liddi, and Nate Tenbrink. Last year I did the same with another player who proved worthy of my fandom; Shawn Kelley. Lonnie Oh, I’m not horribly upset. I just seeing a much bigger need in the very near future for SP, especially if so many folks get their wish and we lose Bedard and Washburn.

Also, I guess I carry water for players who aren’t annointed as the next great thing but succeed anyways. That explains my fixation on guys like Juan Diaz, Alex Liddi, and Nate Tenbrink.

Last year I did the same with another player who proved worthy of my fandom; Shawn Kelley.

Lonnie

]]> By: Jon Shields http://www.proballnw.com/07-2009/master-of-predicting-the-breakout/comment-page-1/#comment-6239 Jon Shields Mon, 13 Jul 2009 23:14:48 +0000 http://www.proballnw.com/?p=1879#comment-6239 I agree with you to a point, Lonnie. When I first saw that we had acquired Hannahan I figured it would have been for some scrub I had never heard of. When I saw it was Souza I was a little disappointed, because he was indeed the most promising starter we had in the high minors until Cortes came along. That said, I don't agree that we need Souza for depth next season. He could probably pitch in a big league pen right now, but I don't think he'd be ready for a big league rotation until late 2010 if that. Learning to be a good starter is a long road for non-elite prospects. The A's won the deal and I'm sure Z knows that he gave up a greater overall talent in Souza than he got in Hannahan, but he wanted a good gloveman and Billy Beane isn't Dayton Moore or Omar Minaya-- he's not going to get swindled. It's not a big enough "loss" to get upset about, in my opinion, because Hannahan is a clear upgrade and Souza is far from a sure thing. It's your opinion Lonnie and that's fine, and I don't wholly disagree with what you're saying, but it's just not enough to upset me, especially when I think about how Bill Bavasi would have traded Michael Saunders and JC Ramirez for Garrett Atkins at this point. :) I agree with you to a point, Lonnie. When I first saw that we had acquired Hannahan I figured it would have been for some scrub I had never heard of. When I saw it was Souza I was a little disappointed, because he was indeed the most promising starter we had in the high minors until Cortes came along.

That said, I don’t agree that we need Souza for depth next season. He could probably pitch in a big league pen right now, but I don’t think he’d be ready for a big league rotation until late 2010 if that. Learning to be a good starter is a long road for non-elite prospects.

The A’s won the deal and I’m sure Z knows that he gave up a greater overall talent in Souza than he got in Hannahan, but he wanted a good gloveman and Billy Beane isn’t Dayton Moore or Omar Minaya– he’s not going to get swindled. It’s not a big enough “loss” to get upset about, in my opinion, because Hannahan is a clear upgrade and Souza is far from a sure thing.

It’s your opinion Lonnie and that’s fine, and I don’t wholly disagree with what you’re saying, but it’s just not enough to upset me, especially when I think about how Bill Bavasi would have traded Michael Saunders and JC Ramirez for Garrett Atkins at this point.

:)

]]> By: Lonnie http://www.proballnw.com/07-2009/master-of-predicting-the-breakout/comment-page-1/#comment-6238 Lonnie Mon, 13 Jul 2009 21:14:12 +0000 http://www.proballnw.com/?p=1879#comment-6238 I hate the trade because Souza was making huge strides this year once he was inserted into the starting rotation. He had been labled a reliever since the day he was drafted and it was great to see him get a chance to start and making the most of it. I believe that what he was putting together in West Tenn could have had a significant impact on the Mariners in the future. Look at it this way, he was the closest and best thing to an MLB ready SP we have in our organization. If we lose Bedard and Washburn this fall, how do we fill those gaping holes? The FA market for SP is going to be crap this fall, so that leaves trades. How much talent is it going to take to land even one mid-rotation starter? That's a butcherbill that makes me shudder. Souza could have, IMHO come in during ST and potentially won a spot away from the Vargas/Olson/RRS group, or supplimented the staff if we lose Bedard and Washburn. From the perspective of what we got in exchange, I just don't see the value of yet another all-glove, no-bat player. How many blackholes can this team carry? Lonnie I hate the trade because Souza was making huge strides this year once he was inserted into the starting rotation. He had been labled a reliever since the day he was drafted and it was great to see him get a chance to start and making the most of it. I believe that what he was putting together in West Tenn could have had a significant impact on the Mariners in the future.

Look at it this way, he was the closest and best thing to an MLB ready SP we have in our organization. If we lose Bedard and Washburn this fall, how do we fill those gaping holes? The FA market for SP is going to be crap this fall, so that leaves trades. How much talent is it going to take to land even one mid-rotation starter? That’s a butcherbill that makes me shudder. Souza could have, IMHO come in during ST and potentially won a spot away from the Vargas/Olson/RRS group, or supplimented the staff if we lose Bedard and Washburn.

From the perspective of what we got in exchange, I just don’t see the value of yet another all-glove, no-bat player. How many blackholes can this team carry?

Lonnie

]]> By: Dustin Shires http://www.proballnw.com/07-2009/master-of-predicting-the-breakout/comment-page-1/#comment-6236 Dustin Shires Mon, 13 Jul 2009 19:18:01 +0000 http://www.proballnw.com/?p=1879#comment-6236 I don't see how you can hate this trade... We gave up a minor league arm with what, a future in the bullpen? We got a useful 3rd baseman who is close to the top in fielding, and any offense we get from him is gravy. I'm totally satisfied with that. I don’t see how you can hate this trade… We gave up a minor league arm with what, a future in the bullpen? We got a useful 3rd baseman who is close to the top in fielding, and any offense we get from him is gravy. I’m totally satisfied with that.

]]> By: Jon Shields http://www.proballnw.com/07-2009/master-of-predicting-the-breakout/comment-page-1/#comment-6234 Jon Shields Mon, 13 Jul 2009 17:53:13 +0000 http://www.proballnw.com/?p=1879#comment-6234 That's just because you were attached to Souza.. I think. That’s just because you were attached to Souza.. I think.

]]> By: Lonnie http://www.proballnw.com/07-2009/master-of-predicting-the-breakout/comment-page-1/#comment-6233 Lonnie Mon, 13 Jul 2009 17:37:00 +0000 http://www.proballnw.com/?p=1879#comment-6233 I think Jack Z may have whiffed on Hanananananananahan. I really, REALLY hate this trade. Lonnie I think Jack Z may have whiffed on Hanananananananahan. I really, REALLY hate this trade.

Lonnie

]]> By: SABR Matt http://www.proballnw.com/07-2009/master-of-predicting-the-breakout/comment-page-1/#comment-6229 SABR Matt Mon, 13 Jul 2009 05:45:28 +0000 http://www.proballnw.com/?p=1879#comment-6229 *sigh*...too bad the Rays backed out on that one...Zobrist could be our SS right now. :( *sigh*…too bad the Rays backed out on that one…Zobrist could be our SS right now. :(

]]> By: Slurve http://www.proballnw.com/07-2009/master-of-predicting-the-breakout/comment-page-1/#comment-6228 Slurve Mon, 13 Jul 2009 02:32:55 +0000 http://www.proballnw.com/?p=1879#comment-6228 Man I really wish we had Ben Zobrist. Man I really wish we had Ben Zobrist.

]]> By: Jon Shields http://www.proballnw.com/07-2009/master-of-predicting-the-breakout/comment-page-1/#comment-6227 Jon Shields Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:08:46 +0000 http://www.proballnw.com/?p=1879#comment-6227 Whoops I must have just been looking at AL. Will fix. Whoops I must have just been looking at AL. Will fix.

]]> By: Dustin Shires http://www.proballnw.com/07-2009/master-of-predicting-the-breakout/comment-page-1/#comment-6226 Dustin Shires Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:06:15 +0000 http://www.proballnw.com/?p=1879#comment-6226 Zobrist is 3rd in WAR. Zobrist is 3rd in ISO. Zobrist is 6th in OPS. Moral of the story: Ben Zobrist has been raping the MLB. Who really cares if he's 1st or 3rd in WAR and OPS. He's near the top, and that's a feat that nobody/few could have predicted. Zobrist is 3rd in WAR.
Zobrist is 3rd in ISO.
Zobrist is 6th in OPS.

Moral of the story: Ben Zobrist has been raping the MLB. Who really cares if he’s 1st or 3rd in WAR and OPS. He’s near the top, and that’s a feat that nobody/few could have predicted.

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